Transcript

Derek Smith:

Hello and welcome to Baylor Connections, a conversation series with the people shaping our future. Each week we go in depth with Baylor leaders, professors and more, discussing important topics in higher education, research student life and more. I'm Derek Smith, and our guest today is Dr. Todd Still. Dr. Still serves as the Charles J. and Eleanor McLerran DeLancey Dean and the William M. Hinson Professor of Christian Scriptures and the George W. Truett Theological Seminary at Baylor University. A licensed and ordained Baptist minister, Dr. Still continues to preach and serve in churches and conference settings alike. Throughout his career in ministry, Dr. Still has served in numerous roles including church custodian, music minister, youth minister, college minister, education minister, pastor and interim pastor. An author Dr. Still wrote Conflict at Thessalonica, and co-authored, Thinking Through Paul. He's also written three commentaries and over 50 articles. Dr. Still is a Baylor graduate. He joined the Truett faculty in 2003 and assumed the role of Dean in 2015. We're so appreciative that he's with us today here on Baylor Connections. Dr. Still happy early Easter to you and thanks so much for joining us.

Todd Still:

Thank you very much, Derek. It's a joy.

Derek Smith:

Well, we appreciate it and again, appreciate you joining in over your computer. Last week was the first time that we recorded outside the studio with Cheryl Gochis and I appreciate her. You were all learning some new technologies here together over the course of the last couple of weeks, and I appreciate you doing that. As we dive in, just curious, how are you and your faculty and students at Truett Seminary handling those transitions centered around COVID-19?

Todd Still:

Derek, thank you for the opportunity to have this conversation. As it happens, you can teach an older dog a new trick. Taking together on the whole, Derek, we are doing well. Up until now, no one associated with the seminary family of whom we are aware has contacted the virus. That in and of itself is a blessing. We're nonetheless knowledgeable and mindful of those who have. Our hearts go out to them even as our prayers go up for them. We miss being together though, day in and day out, at Truett, we miss in person instruction and interaction, worship and fellowships, studying and sharing, praying and listening, laughing and learning and all the things that make life together as a residential seminary community possible. Transitioning our classes to an online environment has been frankly a rather heavy lift for us as it may, we're bearing with one another. I think that students are being patient with professors, professors with students and we're growing more adept and more accustomed to this online mode of delivery day after day. All the while, a number of our students are struggling with lack of work or loss of work due to the COVID-19 restrictions, the shelter in place orders. In an effort to mitigate their hardship, the seminary family, faculty, staff, alumni, friends have generously, and some even sacrificially given funds to meet some of their basic needs such as food and medicine and the like. We're a tight knit community and we are soldiering on, looking out for one another even as we seek to look to the Lord, ultimately the one from whom our help comes.

Derek Smith:

Well that's fantastic to hear the way that the Truett and Baylor family have come together to help students, because we know a lot of them are sacrificing a great deal to make these steps in their lives. For you, you're ministering to them in lots of ways as you're teaching them. What elements of ministry and education are brought into sharper focus by an event like this?

Todd Still:

Derek, as you know, so much of education is relational, formational and so much of pastoral ministry is, the word I would like to use is incarnational. Baylor rightly speaks of itself as a caring community. What is true of the university writ large is no less true of the seminary we trust. One of my favorite passages in the Gospel of John is found in the first chapter, in what is known as the prologue. There, the fourth evangelist declares in the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God. The text continues and the word became flesh and dwelt or tabernacled or even pitched a tent among us. Paul and his letters would write as a person who was cut off from congregation. The epistles were a substitute for the apostle. If he could have been there, he would have been there and there would have been no need for written communication. I for one, am grateful for the technologies that have enabled us to remain connected in these days of social distancing, of shelter in place. Be it video conferencing or email or some application within WebEx and Canvas. But no digital device or remote connection can rival or replicate face to face interaction, the nonverbal communication one is able to pick up on and certainly the personal attention that one is able to give. Humanity, I would argue, craves community. Living in isolation can be debilitating even as it is distancing. It is not good for us to be alone, and I think we're learning that in new ways in these days. I think the myth of the autonomous self is being further imploded and revealed as simply untrue.

Derek Smith:

We are visiting with Dr. Todd Still, Dean and Professor at Baylor's George W. Truett Theological Seminary. Easter weekend brings so much into focus and obviously this year is going to be a different kind of Easter celebration for all of us. We want to dive into some specific questions about that in a moment, but more broadly first, what are some of the topics on your heart and mind as we prepare for this Easter that's unique to 2020?

Todd Still:

Derek, I suspect, I suppose that I am feeling and thinking in ways similar to believers in Christ Jesus the world over. On the one hand I find myself sad, I hunger to go to church together with other believers, not least on Easter Sunday. But on the other hand I'm glad. The reality of Jesus's resurrection is in the final analysis, not contingent upon Christians gathering together in person to celebrate such. To this extent I cannot help but wonder if the range of thoughts and emotions that I, along with others am experiencing is similar to the first Easter. There is Mary Magdalen mourning in the garden, this mourning gives away to her declaring to the disciples after Jesus revealed himself to her, "I've seen the Lord." What Jesus said to his disciples in the upper room discourse in John's Gospel seems particularly applicable just now. He says, "You will grieve, but your grief will turn to joy." There's a certain sadness and gladness, a certain grief mixed with joy. I wonder if that's not how a number of others might be feeling just now.

Derek Smith:

Well, that's a great promise and a great reminder from John as we visit with Dr. Todd Still. As we are, as you mentioned, unable to gather together, we're reminded that the church, it's more than the building and the place that we go on Sundays. Regardless of where, or even if we can meet in person, what are we talking about when we talk about the church? Now, people say growing up with a capital C Church as opposed to the church that we are attending. What are we talking about in that?

Todd Still:

Derek, growing up, I think many of us might have learned with hand motions this saying, here is the church and here is the steeple. Open the doors and see all the people. Our teachers were trying through that simple little rhyme to share with us that the church is about far more than a building. The church is actually, as Paul would call it, a body. It's more than bricks and sticks or nickels and noses. At its core, the church is about people. People who are being transformed and conformed to the character and likeness of Jesus. We know this in principle, theologically, I gather we are learning this afresh and practice in these days. We don't so much go to the Lord's house by virtue of the indwelling spirit of the risen Christ. We are the Lord's house. We are the temple of God. Over the years, I found it quite helpful to think of the church, both local and universal as you were saying, little C, capital C, visible, invisible, gathered, scattered, however you might want to articulate it. I found it also to be valuable to view the church as in the world, seeking the welfare of the city as Jeremiah, the prophet might put it. Yet, not ultimately defined or constrained by the world, reminded of that passage in Revelation for the kingdoms of the world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Messiah and He will reign forever and ever. I think that the strong connection between the church and Christ is the key to negotiating the current nettles created by COVID-19.

Derek Smith:

This is Baylor Connections. We are visiting with Dr. Todd Still, the Charles J. and Eleanor McLerran DeLancey Dean and William M. Hinson Professor of Christian Scriptures and the George W. Truett Theological Seminary at Baylor. Dr. Still, this is not the first time that our world has dealt with an epidemic, with a pandemic or with a crisis in general. Are there times in church history that have provided us with a model of how people of faith or church bodies have navigated challenging situations of the past?

Todd Still:

Derek, there are and the question that you raise is a question that many of us have been asking and seeking to answer. There are being noted and circulated now these examples with some degree of regularity. As it happens, Baylor's own Rodney Stark and Phillip Jenkins have written insightfully and compellingly on such matters. Perhaps a couple of examples will at least for now suffice. During the so-called plague of Cyprian, a pandemic that swept the Roman empire from roughly AD 249 to 262. There were, at one point in time reported some 5,000 people a day that were dying in the capital city of Rome. It was in the midst of this plague, according to Dionysius, who was then Bishop of Alexandria, that belabors the empire over, a quote from Eusebius. We're showing unbounded love and loyalty, never sparing themselves in thinking only of one another, so that many in nursing and curing others, Eusebius reports, transferred their death to themselves and died in the stead of the sick, and with the sick. This is a remarkable example. Rodney Stark in his book, The Rise of Christianity suggests that the response of early Christ followers to one another and to others in times of plague and pandemic was one of the primary, even cardinal reasons that Christianity grew. From what was a significant yet rather small movement within the second century, to some 6 million, as Stark would estimate by the year 300. Not to belabor the point, but another inspiring example about, which I've recently read is the response of Protestant reformer, Martin Luther, and his then pregnant wife Katharina. To a plague that struck Wittenberg, Germany where he was in 1527. Luther would write in a letter now dated to 19 August, 1527, the following. He said, "We must respect the word of Christ. I was sick and you did not visit me." According to this passage, Luther writes, "We are bound to each other in such a way that no one may forsake the other in his distress, but is obliged to assist and help him as he himself would like to be helped." I find both the example of the church during the so-called plague of Cyprian and the model of Luther and his wife, Katharina to be inspiring and instructive, even if at the end of the day there's no one for one correlation between then and now.

Derek Smith:

Well, with that Dr. Still, are there some questions that church leaders might be helpful to ask themselves or ask people they trust in leadership to ensure that they're following in some of those footsteps?

Todd Still:

Derek, it's sometimes been said that questions tell us more than answers. Good questions, even unanswered ones are always in order. I've been wondering myself about some of the better questions to ask, and I've come up with a few. One, how can I personally and our church collectively be faithful to the Lord offering winsome witness in these days? A second, how can I personally and the church collectively support others both spiritually to the extent that we're able and materially, to the extent that we're able? A common question posed in scripture that many of us might be asking is how long oh, Lord, how long? We sometimes are concerned how long this pandemic will persist. What will the toll that it takes actually be? Another question that church leaders have been asking and should ask is, should our congregation or organization receive support from the United States federal government made possible through the Coronavirus Aid Relief and Economic security act, the so-called CARES Act? Then a final question, Derek, that might be particularly important at this time is how can we be ready to pivot once the pandemic passes? There are others, perhaps better ones, but these are a few.

Derek Smith:

We are visiting with Dr. Still Dean and professor at the George W. Truett Theological Seminary. Dr. Still, many of us at times, certainly myself included, it's easy to sometimes be guilty of a consumer mentality of church and its role in our lives. But for us as individuals, how can we use this time to refocus the way we consider church and our role in it?

Todd Still:

Derek, you aren't the only one. I myself and I think probably most of us fall guilty to the question relative to church, what's in it for me? But I think that this pandemic has given us an opportunity to examine our own commitments and to ask what matters most in life? What matters most in death? [inaudible 00:18:33] we could say with Paul, "For me to live is Christ and to die is gain." Jesus when to ask what is the first and the foremost commandment says, "Love God with every fiber of your being and love your neighbor as yourself." There are no commandments Jesus says greater than these. He also teaches us to find our lives by losing them. I think in moments like these, to be able to return to these basic questions, why am I here? How can I best live my life is in fact what we can do in refocusing and recalibrating our lives in Christ and in church during these days.

Derek Smith:

Visiting with Dr. Todd Still. Dr. Still, at the top of the show, we spoke about this briefly, but let's dive a little bit more into Easter and its meaning particularly in light of the current events. Does our current reality of COVID-19 for you bring into sharper focus any elements of the Easter story of Christ's sacrifice?

Todd Still:

What is likely, Derek, the earliest written gospel, the gospel of Mark. It's recorded that from the cross as Jesus was dying, he cried out, "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?" That Aramaic phrase is rendered, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" It's a citation of Psalm 22:1, at least in part. Without question, Jesus felt himself despised, rejected and alone on Golgotha. Without question, Jesus's resurrection signals God's steadfast, unfailing love for His son and for the world. If in this time of pandemic we might feel alone, we can rest assured, Scripture tells us that we're never alone. Jesus assures us of His promised presence even until the end of the age. He's Emmanuel not only at Christmas and Easter, but every day, day in, day out.

Derek Smith:

This year, Dr. Still will by its nature, strip away a lot of the traditions surrounding Easter that have formed over the years. Not only going to church in person, but certainly things like Easter dinner with extended family, dresses, Easter egg hunts, and all good things certainly, but what can the removal of some of those accoutrements mean for Christians individually or as a family, or as a body?

Todd Still:

I, like so many of us enjoy the traditions that have grown up around Easter. I delight in participating in them. In fact, this afternoon, my wife was offering a video scavenger hunt to my five year old nephew in Georgetown. We were loving it together. But that being said, we know at the end of the day, Easter's not about bunnies or bonnets or dresses or dinners or eggs or extravaganzas, we know that Easter is about Jesus Christ risen. It's vital that we remember this, not only at this time of year, but throughout the year. Each year Truett Seminary sends out an Easter card and on the outside of our card this year, a single word is followed with an exclamation mark, Hallelujah! Inside the card, as you open it, it says, among other things, Christ is risen. He's risen indeed. Hallelujah! This so called Easter acclimation or Paschal greeting seems to me to be a suitable, satisfactory if succinct summary of what Easter is truly all about.

Derek Smith:

Well said. Dr. Still, as we head into the final moments on this show here as we close, are there verses or stories from the Bible that particularly speak to you or spark hope during this particular time?

Todd Still:

Derek, one of the disciplines in which I engage is to return to our fourfold gospel witness, Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, and read the resurrection accounts in each of the gospels again. Because they remind us that it's not the end. It's not even the beginning of the end, even if it is the end of the beginning. We have that resurrection hope. Jesus can say to his disciples that he is going ahead of them into Galilee. Hebrews can talk about the fact that Jesus is the pioneer and perfector of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured this shame, despising the cross so that he might lead us forward. The final verse I might share, Derek is a verse that continues to be particularly meaningful to me, not only at Easter but the whole year through. As the apostle Paul comes to the end of what is the most protracted treatment of the topic of resurrection in sacred scripture, in 1 Corinthians 15. He concludes with these hope filled words. He writes, "Therefore, brothers and sisters be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor in the Lord is not in vain." Those words ring true. They remind us that we're more than conquerors in Christ who conquered the death and the grave, and it reminds us that it may be good Friday, but Easter Sunday is just around the chronological and the theological corner.

Derek Smith:

Well, Dr. Still those are great words and certainly a great promise. Who knows, perhaps when some of the smoke clears from COVID-19, we'll be able to hear some really amazing stories from pastors, from church bodies, from individual Christians about work that took place that obviously the scope of which goes above and beyond any of us could do any way, let alone in a time of isolation. Thank you so much for sharing with us that hope and joining us today on the program.

Todd Still:

It's been an honor. Thank you for the invitation, Derek, and I wish you and your family a happy Easter.

Derek Smith:

Well, happy Easter to you and your family as well and to everyone in the Baylor family listening online and on the radio, a happy Easter to all as well. We appreciate everyone joining us and we appreciate you, Dr. Todd Still the Charles J. and Eleanor McLerran DeLancey Dean and William M. Hinson Professor of Christian Scriptures at Baylor's George W. Truett Theological Seminary. I'm Derek Smith, a reminder, you can hear this and other programs online at baylor.edu/connection. Again, happy Easter and thanks for joining us here on Baylor Connections.